WHO WE ARE: From Me to i

Wednesday May 9, 2007 04:08 PM

Who We Are

To learn why Jelena Dokic should play Meryl Streep in her biopic, and vice versa, go to The Tribal Mind.

A column about Australia by David Dale, published in The Sun-Herald 8/2/2009
At last, there's a clever new tool for analysing our society - and it has official sanction.

Remember the golden age (the 80s and 90s) when the pop sociologists seemed to come up with a new label every week - first they talked about
Baby boomers (people born between the end of World War Two and the start of the Vietnam War), then
Yuppies (Young Upwardly-mobile Professionals),
DINKS (Double income No Kids),
Sitcoms (Single Income Two Children Oppressive Mortgage),
SKINs (parents who Spend the Kids' Inheritance Now) and, best of all,
Generation X, a term invented in 1991 by the novelist Douglas Coupland to cover people born between 1965 and 1976, who supposedly felt overshadowed by the boomers.
Then the labellers ran out of imagination. People a bit younger than Generation X were lazily called Generation Y, and we were facing the prospect of Generation Z for those who came after them. But the Bureau of Statistics has fixed that. In its latest report, it has laid down all the social labels we need, and for people born between 1986 and 2006, it has created the term The iGeneration.

This clarification comes just in time. A lot of nonsense is being written in the name of demographic dissection. For example, in a book called Please Just F* off ... It's our turn now, the Australian author Ryan Heath offers these generationalisations:

"Boomers are particularly skilled at whining and slutting their way into society's spotlight ... It's Boomer suburbanites, your Kath and your Kel, who are the majority. They are usually conservative, materialistic and insular ...

"Generation X was a label for drifters with an embittered but denied sense of entitlement and removed from any actual demographic trend ...

"Whereas Boomers wallow in remembrance of the good ol' days, [Generation Y] live change everyday, and rather like it ... My generation is populated by strong and professional individuals with resilience, ideas and critical capabilities ... We are flexible, resilient and can multi-task well. [But] We are often so busy being Yeppies (Young Experimenting Perfection Seekers) -- unable to commit to love or a career because we can never meet our unreasonable expectations".

Sound like anybody you know? The Bureau takes a different approach. Instead of fomenting generational warfare, it uses data from the 2006 census to divide us into five categories: 1 The Oldest Australians (born before 1926); 2 The Lucky Generation (born between 1926 and 1946); 2 Baby Boomers (1946-1966); 4 Generation X and Y (1966-1986); and 5 The iGeneration (born after 1986).

The Bureau says the last group is the most technological and the least spiritual of all the five, which has significant implications for the future shape of society: "They take computers and the internet and a host of electronic consumables, such as DVDs, mobile phones and MP3 players, for granted," says the Bureau. "In 2006, 80 per cent of the youngest generation had access to the internet at home ... The iGeneration, along with Generation X and Y, are the most secular generations, with almost one in four reporting no religion." By comparison, only 9 per cent of the over 60s and 17 per cent of the 40-60s say they follow no faith (go here to read the bureau's report).

So our society is about to be taken over by a generation of geeky heathens.

We'll continue this discussion next week, with full analysis of Boomers, Xers, Luckies and iGens. In the meantime, go to Comments to tell us if you think the Bureau has got it right

David Dale is the author of Who We Are -- A snapshot of Australia today (Allen and Unwin). For daily updates on Australian attitudes, bookmark http://blogs.sunherald.com.au/whoweare.

COMMENTS

To young Master Ryan Heath regarding your claim that "My generation is populated by strong and professional individuals with resilience, ideas and critical capabilities ... We are flexible, resilient and can multi-task well. [But] We are often so busy being Yeppies (Young Experimenting Perfection Seekers) -- unable to commit to love or a career because we can never meet our unreasonable expectations." - just the kind of delusional crap I'd expect from one of the twits I regularly encounter in the course of an average day. Mate, I'd be happy if your lot could get my coffee order right, that's not an unreasonable expectation. I suggest you buy a mirror and take a good long look at yourself.

by Ready to Roll on February 08, 2009 at 12:57 AM

Too late - we've already taken over. Thanks for the recession by the way ;)

by geeky heaten of sydney on February 08, 2009 at 01:56 AM

ha ha ha ha ha ha i loved the comment by geeky heaten, we have taken over and we are doing a better job : )

by Parisa Afshin on February 08, 2009 at 08:18 AM

And just why shouldnt skins spend their money,what gives their kids the right to live in the lap of luxury off something their parents worked hard for all their lives.
EVERY generation or category has the right to spend the money THEY earned ANY way they like,so dont come the raw prawn about spending the kids inheritance.
As for the geeky heathens,"tic"most are people who want everything for as little as possible and are adverse to any kind of physical work,no wonder most things have Velcro on them because the thought of tying shoelaces and such is just too much strain,mobiles with speed dial,most cars being automagic,fast food cos the thought of cooking makes them feel sick,everything electrical has a remote,sheesh they even have to press the button on their car keys to find out where they left their car, just so that they dont have to walk around looking for it.

by hoova on February 08, 2009 at 09:21 AM

You're 23 years old and actually believe you've taken over? And doing a better job?
The fact you can say "thanks for the recession" just shows your youthful ignorance. Recessions are part of the economic cycle. They come and they go. Depressions too. Some are better, some are worse.
The idea that you've taken over and are doing a better job is laughable in the extreme. When you've grown up, acquired some knowledge and put in an effort to DO something rather than stay at home, live off your parents while spending all the money you've made at your low-level job on holidays and clothes then we can talk about your contribution.
Right now you're just ipod wearing rock stars without the rock. You've got all the potential in the world but potential is just another word to say you haven't done anything yet.
When you're relevant and not just a marketing demographic you let us know.

by Orphean on February 08, 2009 at 09:23 AM

Just because the iGen etc are not religious doesn't mean they're not spiritual Dave, actually it means they have their own connection - there is no longer a need for churches to lead the way.

by Ajna on February 08, 2009 at 10:11 AM

On "heathenism": Comparing the 1996 and 2006 Census, Christian affiliation declined in *every* age cohort. Among those born 1972-81 (the current parent generation), only 55% were nominally Christian. Weekly church attendance has now fallen below 8% of the population. Only about 30% of marriages are officiated by a minister of religion.
These trends are common to all developed countries (with the exception of the US), and demonstrate an irreversible secularisation of the modern world. The attraction of Iron Age sky gods, and their pompous representatives, is in fatal decline. Hooray!

by JohnC on February 08, 2009 at 10:23 AM

I was born in the early 1960s. For years the baby boomers (remember when generations were 15 years apart- hence baby boomers were '45 to 59/60?) wouldn't have a bar of me and my generation. We grew up with space travel and television and never sat round the radio listening to argonauts. I was finally relieved in the '80s to have a label (albeit the insipid gen X ) with which to identify. Then in the early 2000s statisticians (I suspect on the basis of their own birthdates) began to waver in determining generational cut off dates. Now alas with the stroke of a pen I am a baby boomer! With this generational displacement I must now forsake my decades of cultural identity and indoctrinate myself with the tenets of the previous generation. Until next year when perhaps I am moved again?

by displaced on February 08, 2009 at 10:27 AM

C'mon Orphean... give the dim-wits a go! It's worth remembering that it's the preceding generations that mollycoddled and wrapped these self-centred, self-delusional individuals in a constructed falsehood of unreality.
It began with the belief that "the future is our kids", which got warped into "we must bend over and offer our butts for shafting in order to have properly adjusted kids"... We can't blame the 'kids' for believing the drivel we fed them...
Such drivel made me want to puke back then and it's no different now.
As for whether the 'Bureau' has got it right... Like most generalisations they've got it sorta generally right except for the exceptions that they've either overlooked as being insignificant or of little influence upon what they've pre-determined must indicate a general trend.
In this regard, they are the perfect example of the generation/s they belong to. Ignore anything that doesn't agree with the preconceived stereotypes they've already assumed the data must provide - and mystically, everything aligns correctly after some careful culling of the 'useless bits' of data!
It ain't just the 'i-gen' that takes all the superficial trimmings of modern society for granted. Older generations take for granted that the young will always be a better and more capable bunch of people than they themselves were (such deluded old tools), which enables elements within succeeding generations to "pull the wool".
I've seen evidence (working for an organisation where digital technology is our tools) that no generation is more or less technologically "savvy" than another - despite all the comments I hear that should convince me otherwise like "oh, my grandkids/kids/young acquaintances are just such whizz's at using stuff I can't wrap my head around."
Ignorance isn't anything to guage someone else's compotence against!!
Bureau schmuro - it's run by Boomers, staffed by Gen X and Y, who are supervised by yuppies, dinks, sitcoms and skins, so what else would we expect it to conclude?!!
At least we can all be happy, knowing that the Bureau of Statistics is keeping the true spirit of the Public Service alive and well! :)

by Steve C on February 08, 2009 at 10:59 AM

As another born in the early 60's I too had grown up gen x only to be later told: no, baby boomer... curious as a child of punk rock and the New Romantics in music movements I have little in common at all with the Baby Boomers so this should be revised back to the original Gen x label I suspect.
Ruling the world...taking over...always an interesting notion and I once sat in a room where the writer of the 'f..k off' statement proclaimed they where all ahead and ready to take over as they had the net etc.....great shame it, apple etc was all brought to world wide wonder by a couple of old Gen xers.....sorry what have you created? The other curious clash for me is the broad statement of 'we're not christians...the churches are irrelevant"?
Tell me that when your trapped in a car with your life ebbing away by the minute and you realise that you aren't going to last 5 more minutes let alone years and then when you start praying for ten more minutes ...then tell me the church is irelevant. It's trendy to say you dont beliieve in God until the giant hand of something we don't understand or control appears to turn that stuff all upside down.
Tell the millions of poor in Mexico, the Phillipines, America, Africa and the various addicts and down and outs in aus that the church is irrelevant as they get shelter, food, friendship and support from one of the many branches of the church that support those less fortunate than comfortable middle class kids in Aus.
Don't be so arrogant...while you can think you have taken over.....still waiting for the evidence that you have created or taken over anything...get over yourself and realise you are not the centre of the Universe and by the time you have finished reading this and paid for another download (if indeed you bother to pay for someone elses creativity) thousands have literally died as the body has given up on them through lack of basic water and food. Remember some irrelevant church person has had to decide who to feed and who not to while you decide to be cranky about what trck you might listen to next.
And now a little peek at Gen x...yes I am and always will be that lot no matter what a statistician says. I expected to be fried in an atomic apocolypse at any point during the 70's as russians and americans played itchy fingers over buttons that could kill us all. It wasn't a Terminator fantasy we knew it might happen...how's that for a bleak future so we rebelled against having no control through punk rock and piercings and then realised that we didn't want to die and wanted a better world and so along came the new romantics and electronic music because we wanted technology to save us and stop the possability of it destroying us....sound familiar...look at the age of the Terminator movie creators. Then with the hope that technology could help us slide past goverment a thing called The Net was ushered in.
We are waiting to see what you bring to the table to change things..............
a better coffee making machine?
Good luck.

by Displaced as well on February 08, 2009 at 11:21 AM

I was born in 1964 and like "displaced" I was always considered an "Xer" not that that was particuly appealing but I refuse to be considered a baby boomer because the buearu changes the goal posts later in life! Besides the boomer's golden age was the 1960s right, with the mantra 'ï¿½f you can remember the 60s you weren't really there' well my memory of that time is a little hazy and it's not because of any chemically mind altering expirences...

by Damien T on February 08, 2009 at 11:32 AM

ha ha steve c, on the money.
oh yeah, @geeky heaten (sic), you call this a recession? this isn't a recession....

by logicbox on February 08, 2009 at 11:53 AM

A generation of tech-loving geeky heathens?! At last! Perhaps 40 years from now we'll finally have people over 60 who don't shove their morality down your throat and can program their own VCRs.

by Steve R on February 08, 2009 at 12:00 PM

Displaced's nick should be "(God) Deluded". You think when the chips are down we heathen geeks are gonna grovel to your fictional sky faerie? I will however be cursing you for having squandered hundreds of millions of tax dollars for fire-fighting to pay for ratzingers paedofest. The world is burning while you lame losers pray. F*ck off.

by iBoomer on February 08, 2009 at 01:05 PM

These young know it all freaks who have never achieved anything of worth because everything they have of worth was given to them by their mummies and daddies are in for a rude shock... The world is ruthless and does not give out anything for nothing.
Because these young freaky technologically advanced couch potatoes were babied all through their young lives means they know nothing of hardship.
Lets see how they react when they cant get a job! If they think other generations gave them the credit crunch well ... Do you have a personal loan? Credit Card? GE Finance?
Remember that job you cant get.. Good luck paying your debts. ITS TIME TO LEARN ABOUT THE REAL WORLD KIDS!
I think the B.O.S. has got it pretty right, the iGeneration tag is totally spot on the i is absolutely right .. its the I AM Generation with a twist... It is now going to be called the I ARENT! Generation.
Dont come to me for a job!

by Vaughan on February 08, 2009 at 01:06 PM

Just because the modern (western) age is leading us to a secular society with at the least the majority not having religous practices doesn't mean it is the right thing to do (all it means is that the majority of Australians are not going to Church). On a global perspective the majority do believe in a god of some sort and that the western secularist is in the minority. So who now is right?
PS what is the primary characteristic of 17 out of the top 20 charities in Australia -they are Christian based (and I assume with siginificant funding by churchgoers). So now that Aust is non-religious, will the non-religous stand up and look after the needy? On the basis of past performance that seems unlikely.

by Steve on February 08, 2009 at 01:32 PM

Dear iGen,
Not so long ago a bunch of geeky people had an idea as to how to reshape society using technology. The usual players, estates 1-4, had to be sold in order to initiate the changes. Now 1-4 understand that, well, that they donï¿½t understand and that the game has moved on.
So you think youï¿½re a sophisticated technically literate individual. Try these.
Explain the architecture and function of your PC processor, your PC, the internet and your cell phone device, OK just for this demographic the iPod/iPhone.
Explain the architecture and function of the power generation and transmission system, also the water supply system.
Explain the planetary heat flows and how they relate to geology and geography. While youï¿½re at it discuss the implications for so called global warming.
Discuss the practices relating to modern agriculture, food processing and distribution.
Explain all the major systems in a car, OK iGen, hybrid car. Discuss the performance maxima and minima inherent in the design from the perspective of vehicle dynamics, mechanical design and battery and fuel chemistry.
Explain the global system of trade and finance. Explain how, why and when you would crash or inflate the system. Define Ponzi scam. Discuss compulsory investment of superannuation into the stock-market from the perspective of the Boomer population bulge.
Discuss modern diagnostic practices of medicine, together with surgical techniques, major drug classes and their pharmacology.
Explain the micro structure of iron, steels, carbon fibre, aluminum, quantum dots and concrete, Give examples of how to create all of these and how to use them.
Explain the development of civilizations including Mesopotamia, Egypt, China, Assyria, Persia, Sparta-Greece, Rome, Mongol, Holy Roman Empire, British, and Hapsburgï¿½
Explain the design, operation and performance of (known) modern weapons systems.
Explain the performance of the road network using combinatorics and queue theory as a basis; while youï¿½re at discuss the movement of information through large scale organizations, with emphasis on the effect of delays and latency on the operation of the macro system.
So how did you go iGen? Brilliant I bet, because you are so brilliant, everyone tells you that, and all your friends tell you that you are brilliant. That is important iGen because without a background grounded in the marriage of practical experiment/experience applied to theoretical structures, in at least the above fields, you could be manipulated by silly stories. I could for example tell you that the processer firmware in your two camera/GPS phone or was being used to spy on you and track your movements, alternatively I cold tell you that the emissions from your car, or even cow farting, were causing the earthï¿½s weather to go haywire and that you need to pay a tax/tithe/temple offering to make it all go away. I could even say the iPod was a good design that worked well.
Being proficient in a graphic design program or a social networking site whilst living in the inner city and drinking boutique coffee does not make you a player. Nor does being part of the finance, politico, legal or journalistic crowd make you a player. It makes you a product of the new landscape.
Youï¿½re not taking over iGen; youï¿½re fulfilling the design of others,
Welcome to the world created by those that came before you. Enjoy the program.
Regards,
artman

by artman on February 08, 2009 at 01:41 PM

As someone whom travels around the country to provide training in the Web 2.0 and doing business online space. I feel I can safely say that the younger generations have only slight more knowledge about the internet & computers than the older generations.
Sure they can sign up for a facebook account, download a few tunes off iTunes and get it onto their ipods. But ask them how to do business online or why a website works.... no idea.
The younger generations might be more comfortable with a computer because they where bought up with one however that does not mean they know the best way to use it. And certainly most have no idea how to make a business work online.
It is a stereotype that needs to die, if you need proof look at all the rubbish Australian based websites in the SME space. The vast majority built by the know it all young web guru.
Really no idea.

by Dave on February 08, 2009 at 02:26 PM

I'm just hoping those irritating little Gen Y's discover the spell check function some time.

by John D on February 08, 2009 at 02:47 PM

John D wrote: "I'm just hoping those irritating little Gen Y's discover the spell check function some time."
And hope they've selected "English - International" as the 'dictionary', rather than the default "English - US".
Whatsa de-fault? It'sa da ting wad da bebe boomez haf 4 nod bein vigelant wen dey had da chanze... Sugg on dat fogeez!! ;)

by Steve C on February 08, 2009 at 03:31 PM

Firstly - "with resilience" hahah - Said some thing "mean" (which could be anything cause they sulk all the time) to them and they cant take it!! they cant take anything!!!!
Second - Taken over - hahah - cause its in print - you would beleive anything, as long as its on tv of the net....hahahah - the other fella is right, cant even make a cup of coffee without stuffing it up!! The only things you are lucky about is that we cant slap you twits on the back of your head when u are rude and selfish - its a pity, you would learn something from it, cause if we do smack u across the back of the head - OMG!!!! Your whole world and future comes crashing down and "What about me....mmmwwwaaaaaaa - LOL. Resilience...my ass!! and if u were, no worries for the recession, we will let all you "im in bad debt by the age of 20 cause marketing told me to buy it and i would fit in then" fix the finances - HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

by Josip on February 08, 2009 at 05:04 PM

"Dear iGen,
Not so long ago a bunch of geeky people had an idea as to how to reshape society using technology. The usual players, estates 1-4, had to be sold in order to initiate the changes. Now 1-4 understand that, well, that they donï¿½t "
Dear artman,
gimme a sec, i'll just google all that, and cut/paste out of wikipedia.

by kris on February 08, 2009 at 05:07 PM

One can hardly blame the 'iGeneration' for their faults. I was born in '92, and therefore fit into that category, and yet I am a Christian, have no ipod, xbox or other technological 'staples', and would hardly consider myself 'Geeky'. Though one can damningly denounce a generation as lazy and fallen prey to technoligically-induced slothfulness, ignorance and apathy, it's hardly a reasonable generalisation. There is, at my school at least, a growing Christian group and a great deal of pro-exercise and pro-sport sentiments are flying around.
Additionally, it is stupid to blindly blame the recession on 'Generation X' or 'SKINS'. Isn't it quite clear that Australia is comparatively bloodless after the financial crisis? How much of the US$18 Trillion lost was lost in Australia? It is clear that those at fault are greedy entrepeneurs and lazy Wallstreet billionairs who have allowed algorithms they don't understand to run a financial system they no longer understand into the ground. One can accuse the 'igeneration" of ebing overly reliant upon technology and 'heathen' as well, but at least we don't create money that doesn't exist in the trillions. How Spiritual is that, anyway?

by Jimmy on February 08, 2009 at 05:16 PM

Wow. The hatred coming off my browser I would have anticipated from younger audiences...not so much from anyone aged 15+
Hate to break it to you Dave but understanding social media, the realm of web 2.0 and being computer literate has nothing to do with selling online, and knowing instinctively how the apply web 2.0 practices to business. Just like every Gen Xer or Boomer wouldn't know how to write a business plan, or media schedule...It's best left to the experts...And while you're looking at all the websites created by "know it all young web guru" take a look at Australian websites in the SME space in general. It's normally some boomer running the business, who doesn't value the expertise of a marketer or digital expert and opts to do it on the cheap. Garbage in garbage out still applies to the online space.
Dear Artman,
Why would I need to explain all of that, without the aid of some help? What, we're espousing the benefits of rote learning now?

by Sydney on February 08, 2009 at 06:06 PM

So much anger and for what?
You raised us, you deal with us just like your parents dealt with you and their parents with them.
I'm part of the so-called iGeneration and I can tell you there are still some hard working kids out there. I have my own property, a wife a daughter and a full-time job. All paid for by me and I am only 20 years old.
I work at IT company and know much less than the majority of older people who work there. But rather than complain I try and learn as much as I can from them. The negative attitude being displayed by older generations does nothing to improve the state of the current one.
Besides, since when have teenagers ever been tolerable anyway?

by Alex on February 08, 2009 at 07:23 PM

"Taken over." Ho ho ho hee hee hee, what's that? "taken over..."? tee hee hee. Oh I think I just wet myself. "Taken over" Oh that's a good one. "Running things better" Ahh haa haa. What exactly have you taken over you juvenile twit? The World? Which world? Second Life or the World of Warcraft? Maybe if you'd learned a few things about manners and humility you're generation wouldn't be so unpopular with others. You actually think you're running things because you know how to use Wikkipedia, and can transfer your favourite songs to an MP3 player. I almost hope we do have a recession then you'll learn what it means to do your job properly when there are fifty others lining up to take it from you. Unfortunately I've already lived through one and I know that it will affect everyone not just the vain and stupid, and I don't want to go through all that hardship again.

by Ready to Roll on February 08, 2009 at 07:32 PM

What a load of rubbish. This pigeon holing or segmenting of large sections of the population is simply so that marketing people can imagine (or fool clients) that they know what they're doing.
Like most people I have attributes of all the groups mentioned and identify with none of them.
Interestingly, this post has brought all of the religiots out with the usual bogus claims about atheists and talking up their laughable beliefs and notions about xian churches. It's good news that it appears so many of the iGeneration appear to be awake to the lie of religious/spiritual "faith". Here's hoping for a world where religion is consigned to the position of irrelevance that it so richly deserves.

by Grrlscientist on February 08, 2009 at 07:53 PM

I am a boomer. I support all the Gen Xers in this forum in their claim to distinction rather than being lumped in with us boomers. The sixties was a quantum leap ahead from the '46 to '59 era.
I am also happy to hear that all the generations after us have a secular approach to their contemporaries rather than the doctrines my generation carries with them.
Lastly I can't help feeling that althoo the igeneration are going to reshape the world in their techno image the whole process will inevitably have a certain feeling of dejavu about it.
By the way, I'd appreciate if a Gen X, Y or I person could pop in and load my iPod, tune my DVD recorder and organise my iPphone. Love gadgets - hate setting them up.

by Old Boot on February 08, 2009 at 08:53 PM

@artman: Spot on... To turn Some of the vitriol spewed out by the 'Gen Y'/i to which I belong is disturbing.
In saying that, this is primarily caused by, and I choose my words carefully here... the moral relativism and 'rights' without responsibility of the 1960's thru 80's. Not coincidentally the height of the feminist movement.
Now. Society goes on, it's just going to be a tough few decades while the wake up call is delivered to every generation for most of those who came out of the last hard times have now moved on.

by Jezz on February 08, 2009 at 09:15 PM

Someone earlier made the statement about breathing your last breaths in a car accident and then discovering religion. I just hope that for all of you and your biases and generalisations, if you are in an accident you don't mind who it is that comes to your aid - Boomer, Gen X, Gen Y or iGen.

by Maureen on February 08, 2009 at 11:38 PM

Except no one mentions that there are literally millions of ****wads who are apathetic and ignorant who want government to choke society to death with social controls. the new generations

by Jeremy on February 09, 2009 at 12:39 AM

@hoova - Did the "SKINS" receive inheritance from their parents/grandparents? yeah - probably did.

by BG on February 09, 2009 at 05:37 AM

The worry isn't that only 1 in 4 believe in religion - it's that 3 in 4 are believers in superstitious claptrap.

by dot on February 09, 2009 at 06:44 AM

Jeezzz so much hate goin around in here ...
i would expect this kinda of behaviour from a kid in kindy ...
also i dont get the thign people have with this "iPod" like its the biggest marketing scandle around seconded by the company thats makes the goddamn thing...
At artman:
can you answers all those questions?
if u can u must bee one of these professional students wasting money on continuing university and not forwarding the countries economic growth...
now one thing i do agree on is these people with "aussie pride" you know the ones...
southern cross tats
aussie flags
stickers on the car
who go round drunk doing stupid shit
yes i am 17
yes i do have a well paying job
no i dont have an iPod
no i do not believe in god... you can believe in something but it doesnt mean its the truth.
i believe in spellcheck...
but IE6 dont got it :|

by Macleay on February 09, 2009 at 07:03 AM

Actually many Gen X'ers believe in a God/dess - just not BibleGod.
Oh and FYI, heathen is not a derogatory label for non-christians, it's latin and literally means "one who dwells on the heath" in modern terms someone who lives on the outskirts of a city - so anyone in the Greater West of Sydney really. Heathen (capital H) denotes someone who follows the reconstructionist religion of Asatru. So either way, it's not an apt label for atheist or agnostic.

by Hekate on February 09, 2009 at 07:32 AM

Only one in four? I would have hoped the statistics were far higher. Im proud to say that about one in four of my friends 'follow' any kind of religion...if not less. You'd think that in the year 2009 people would wisen up and realise religion offers only ridiculous answers to questions that back then couldnt be answered, and with todays technology and research finally can.
How did we get here? Hmmmm....maybe some guy with a beard thought us up *ERRRR* Wrong! Im looking forward to the future, when we do away with this superstitious crap and step up to the plate. Till then, god save the queen, god save us all, god smite Kevin Rudd!...oh and smite me too, cus i plan on breaking at least 3 commandments today (hopefully 4)

by Chris soll on February 09, 2009 at 08:43 AM

Such vitrtiol, guess generational conflict still abounds, for that much ABS may be on the mark.
Though really, there is nothing scary about secularism, just one less special interest group trying to dictate the rules of society over the rest of us. I won't be weeping over the decline in belief of some misogynistic and spitefull dellusion.
As for those decrying "wake up to the real world", you sound bitter at the hope that they might actually make the world better than the inequitable and conflict ridden place it is today... showing your disdain for hope is sad, but ultimately disdain is futile.

by Terry on February 09, 2009 at 09:12 AM

Marketing to, and defining "generations" is about one thing: conformity. Regardless of your generation - if you see yourself as belonging to a certain set of generational attributes you are displaying, more than anything else, a distinct lack of imagination. In any era it is the outsiders who are interesting - no amount of web surfing, ipod listening or wearing of your generation's jeans is going to change that.

by stvbee on February 09, 2009 at 09:43 AM

I teach iGens at university and while they have the world (well a slick image of it) at their digital finger tips they have little desire to risk much in learning to understand it. They seem to lack critical perspective in so many basic areas.
Mind you, I am an X generation person and looking back on the angst and faked bohemianism I wasted myself and so much time on, I am not one to preach.
However maybe the strength of those born 1966-86 are they took a few more risks than young people seem to be interested in taking today. The fashions of the day were not all completely commodified products. One could make it, fake it, steal it.
Experience over expense. Risk over image. Adaption over resilience. As for the flouted quality of flexibility...ask anyone working 60 hours a week on three contract jobs, one of which is in another town, how good it feels to be 'flexible'.

by Jim on February 09, 2009 at 10:01 AM

So much rage from the boomers...guess you just have to hope that we have enough left after your conspicuous consumption recession to pay for your healthcare. Although as proud Gen Y, let's face it, we don't really care - you have super!

by HarryC on February 09, 2009 at 10:03 AM

Please no more journalists trying to coin their own terms. Its so annoying.

by Phil on February 09, 2009 at 10:03 AM

It occurred to me the other day that one dividing line between gen-X and gen-Y is that the former probably read "1984" when that was in the future, and understood that it was a future to be guarded against. Gen-Y got to think "well, that didn't happen", and have blithely ignored it...

by Andrew on February 09, 2009 at 10:08 AM

I was born in 1986, so by the Bureau's reckoning, I was on the last chopper out of Gen Y. I'm also a geeky heathen, and proud of it - and if society looks to be heading more in that direction, go us!

by Foz Meadows on February 09, 2009 at 10:09 AM

"Its their turn", give me a breakï¿½ï¿½ your turn for what Ryan, like most of your generation you were spoilt, overindulged and given everything, you have no respect for your elders or your family (including your baby boomer parents who put you through uni). This generation, including Master Heath, hold a succession of jobs, most for no longer than a year, and do not commit to much because they have never had to. Ryan, whilst he may have worked in some high profile environments, we could not say is learned, respected or has achieved anything remarkable ï¿½ whereï¿½s the substance Ryan? You see, THAT comes with time and experienceï¿½ï¿½

by Cuz on February 09, 2009 at 10:22 AM

Can we please stop promoting Master Heath as some sort of generational icon? And expert on..... well, nothing. I am so over him, he turns 29 this year, time to get a job, a mortgage and a dose of reality!

by Sick of Ryan on February 09, 2009 at 10:29 AM

I agree with the few posters who either write the data off as statistical bumph that was probably originally collected for a purpose but now provides marketers with convenient officially endorsed market segments. Obviously as a discussion piece it provokes much debate some of it admittedly very interesting but at the end of the day who really gives a hoot what the ABS reports. Big numbers can be read through infinite spectrums and used for any angle of opinion desired.
There are multiple generations who live in different mindsets - thats all I garnered from the report....big surprise huh? The human race does not need another reason to divide and vilify we have plenty of other equally arbitrary categories we can drop people we don't like into so year of birth is probably a level of detail we don't need.........

by Jesse on February 09, 2009 at 10:37 AM

Hah, this is quite interesting.
I was born in 1969 - so I'm whatever group you want to put me in.
Over the 30 years of observing the world that I have done voluntarily (I was like that as a kid), I have noticed that, in 2009 we still have the same 2 parties elected over and over again, the Murdoch Press products still being bought on a daily basis, a complaint-based and quick-money-for-no-work-based society not losing ANY of its hold, same dysfunctional relationships being trotted out down the line ....
OK, you get what I mean. There is one thing I wish the New Agers got right. That is, an 'evolved' society that moved towards enlightenment, harmony and peace. So far, not so good.
Churches going to dissapear in 100 years as secularism increases? No. Why would they? They serve a social function, and an easy way of describing the instable and highly chaotic (to us) world. Why should iGen be the first out of thousands of generations to dump that practice?
Speaking of control, we just had our first baby 10 days ago. His birth was not diaried/iCal'ed, it happened when it did. But now, you can just go to a hospital and make the baby come out when YOU want to. Previous generations didn't have that option. So either a) we are the first generation to have no patience or b) we are now able to do what people have always wanted to.
It was the first time I realised that I needed control/security around what was happening. It threw me and my wife quite off balance at times when we dwelled on it, but we just took it as a lesson. We were happy that we got a taste of things beyond our control.
Well, I guess it would be nice to say, "I own an ipod, 10 different email addresses, and have 3 websites under my name. I am inherently different to previous generations, and have broken free of the habits of my ancestors...because I can snark, am funky and have LOTS of friends." But I would agree with an above poster....we're just playing out the designs of people richer than us. Maybe GenX, Y, Z, AA, AB...AV are the first generations to think materialistic things, how important their friends think they are, and the places they are seen at, inherently make them different or immune to the past. (e.g. Hitler was before the Internet...)
Then again, the same goes for those who run around on OzDay with flags shouting 'Aussie!'. The ones who really run the country aren't as obsessed about either ipods or aussie flags, as those who wave them.
Oh, spot on comments about lack of critical thinking. It's one thing I want my children to be able to do. It's fun to do anyway....
Great conversation.

by Eric Vigo on February 09, 2009 at 11:21 AM

Segmentation of the age groups with names is pointless, especially for those snotty-nosed little brats who are under twenty-one; just do your chores, be quiet, go to your room, do your homework and wait ‘til you leave home and get a job before you start dictating to me how the world should look. When you work, contribute and run it as I and my fellow Boomers do now, you can have a say. Until then, shut the Hell up.

by BoomerTown Rat on February 09, 2009 at 12:18 PM

As someone born straddling the line that separates Gen X and Y, I'm lamenting the fact that the bulk of the Gen-Yers cannot construct a sentence without using text messaging abbreviations. Half of the supposedly educated lot with Comm-Law degrees I manage simply cannot spell or know how to use punctuation.

by Link-age on February 09, 2009 at 12:27 PM

I am NOT a boomer....I was born in 1963, overshadowed by the boomers of the 40's and 50's. I prefer the demographers who refer to those born between 1961-70 are "cuspers" ...neither boomer nor X and a mixture of both

by sybella on February 09, 2009 at 12:56 PM

Wow, so much anger!!
I guess we've discovered what happened to the Baby Boomer's sense of humour - it skipped a generation and went to Gen Y! :D

by TechnoMonkey on February 09, 2009 at 04:00 PM

Really you lot! All your bile and ill considered ranting would be so much more effective if you could just learn to structure a sentence and spell correctly! (Or even approximately!) It's all a bit sad really....

by sixstitcher on February 09, 2009 at 06:02 PM

"[Generation Y] live change everyday, and rather like it ..."
About sums it up, really. A generation whose members don't know the difference between "everyday" and "every day". And who think the words "live change" makes some kind of sense.
Not their fault they can't think, of course. Blame the generation who failed to educate them. But we'd better not take what they try to say seriously, or attach any importance to it. When we start to try to make sense of what the sheep say and do, we're really in the poo.

by Billius on February 09, 2009 at 06:22 PM

I find it offensive that Atheists are referred to as 'heathens'. I consider myself lucky to be exposed to factual, rational and logically explanations of the world around me and 'God created it' just didn't cut it with the wealth of knowledge at my disposal. I don't need to create mythical ideologies in alternate realities to justify my morals, actions and existence.

by Nic on February 09, 2009 at 09:25 PM

Just wait for the trademark ambush Apple's going to unleash on an entire generation.... Prepare to be confiscated - but you guys'll probably just enjoy it.

by amy on February 09, 2009 at 10:23 PM

As a 1982-born (yes, 26 years old) Gen-Y'er I am embarassed by some of the bravado I read from my fellow demographic. I do, however, think that bravado is a positive thing too - let me try to explain why...
I have a Master's Degree and work as a professional in a highly skilled environment. Everything I have was earned by me (no, my parents never bought me a car, any clothes after I turned 15, my education, my iPod or my house). All this happened because of a certain degree of bravado on my part (and parents who raised me well of course).
It is a constant source of frustration to be maligned by my (older) peers purely for being a Gen-Y. It is all too often forgotten that gen-y has some wonderful attributes that, while annoying to those of you who don't have them, will eventually show themselves to be invaluable in the changing face of business:
1. Ability to multi-task
2. Ambition
3. Confidence
4. Initiative
5. Technological know-how (why do non-gen-y seem to find this so threatening?)
Don't make the mistake of underestimating us!
The primary lament I often hear is that young people change jobs too quickly because they are spoiled, arrogant and have no attention span. Quite frankly, the days of the career-path-pension-"22 to 55" companies are over so yes, we will seek a better placement if we are not happy. I am yet to come across someone who can convince me that is a bad thing. We have choices and confidence and exercise those to find companies that work for us (heaven forbid we might actually find the 'job satisfaction' I don't think my father had the luxury of enjoying). The message for employers is: if you have someone good, make them happy (or at least better than the alternatives).
All this said, I know that there ARE obnoxious, self-entitled, lazy prats out there. Were there not any in your generation???
Generation wars aside, we have been left with some extremely serious legacies (environment being the main one springing to mind). Instead of maligning us, how about contributing to the salvage of what has been left to us???
It's all ours next...I think that's a positive thing.

by Laura82 on February 09, 2009 at 10:52 PM

As one born in June 1931 at the beginng of the greatest Depression the world had ever seen I would like to know the PERSON that invented the term of the LUCKY GENERATION for us.
If you consider the fact that there was in Australia at that time over 30% of unemployment against the unacceptable 5% currently,
the "unlucky generations" born after us might begin to realise what the word STRUGGLE REALLY MEANS.
Like for instance walking to school to and from every day up to 3 or 4 miles every day, hail rain or shine, summer and winter.
Many of course bare footed, those lucky enough to have shoes had inner soles of cardboard to cover the holes in the soles.
On many ocassions this was done, if you were LUCKY, on a breakfast of bread and dripping on many occasions and a repeat at night.
We can't forget the many mid night flits and evictions because parents could not pay the rent.
This was followed by the 2nd World War with Dad's and Mum's over seas fighting for democracy with Goverments promising to reward every one by a brave new world and other such bull dust
After the war the LUCKY GENERATION had to set about finding jobs which had in the nations interest wages frozen during the war.Engineering Apprentices were working a 44 hour week for less than $2 PER WEEK and had to attend Technical College two nights a week in their own time and pay their own fares.BUY YOUR OWN BOOKS AND WAS REIMBURSED IF YOU HAD A SATISFACTORY PASS IN EXAMS.
Fortunately we had strong Unions who established, after a long struggle, decent wages and conditions for all including Apprentices.
We also were lucky when we finished our Apprenticeship to have a BOB MENZIES LIBERAL RECESSION in the early 1950'S, followed by several in the 1960'S and '80'S
It was the so called OLDER GENERATION and the LUCKY GENERATION that began the fight to improve the wages and conditons of work which resulted in the 38/ 35 hours of work, increased over time pay, paid time at Tech. College for App. ,Long Service Leave at 10 years, full pay on Workers Compensation,four weeks Annual Leave with 17.5% extra pay leave loading etc.etc. and last but not least SUPERANNUATION FOR ALL WORKERS.
Imagine how we felt when the later generations with all benefits bestowed upon them by us began to trade away many of the hard won conditions.
To cap it all the geeks and gooks, the GREEDY GENERATION has torpeoded our efforts by causing a WORLD WIDE RECESSION WHICH HAS THE POTENTIAL TO OUT DO EVEN THE GREAT DEPRESSION.
I would think I could speak for the OLDER AND SO CALLED LUCKY GENERATIONS when I say we should be called the T & S GENERATION I.E. TOUGH AND STRONG.

by Stuart Maurice on February 10, 2009 at 09:33 AM

Who we are:
Who we can be?
The beneficial side to this exercise is no matter the generation we are grouped in, is that we stand on the shoulders off the group before us, learn and grow wiser.
Yes the iï¿½s generation should be brighter and more intelligent than rest of us. Yet, now in the developed world we are going backwards regarding their health and well being.
Is where their attention and time spent ï¿½SITTINGï¿½ be it the car/desk/computer is slowly depleting their mental and physical health.
Least my foot steps, were foot steps to school and free unrestricted play. Now we can measure their foot steps as ï¿½Carbon foot printsï¿½ mainly due to the consumptions of electronic gadgets and fake food. (Packaged/Processed Food) & Mumï¿½s/Dad FWD.
I have read health reports that a few Doctors want money set aside for lap banding for bad cases of obesity in this group. (Most obese children have over weight parents) Then mental issues such as ADD & ADAH, we have teenagers suicide due to Retalin. Other worry groups are EMOS and Anerxia Nervosa.
We need to get wake up their parents and say ï¿½you child needs a strong wise person to guide them, being their best friend is not workingï¿½
When I had a tiff at school a slap across the face was it, now girls kick girls in the head whilst on the ground, then post the image on UTube.
I am happy to be a boomer, I have learnt from the Generations before me, have taken care of my health and free of Adult diseases that some iï¿½s generation have. My suggestion is for good health is consume 95% good and 5% bad and let the foot prints you make be your own and not ï¿½CARBON FOOT PRINTSï¿½
i Generation stand up be responsible ï¿½MOVEï¿½ and show us the best you can be!

by Gail Davey on February 10, 2009 at 01:22 PM

Laura82 wrote: Don't make the mistake of underestimating us!
My undies have been upgraded simply because I don't make the mistake of underestimating the impact the generations that succeed my own (and your's) are going to have.
Now that's confidence for you! :)
DD wonders:"your's"? What kind of example is that to a generation with limited skills in grammar and spelling?

by Steve C on February 10, 2009 at 03:54 PM

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