Matthew Hall
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Socceroos Versus Football
No sport has the right to own the name football.
That's what Football Federation Australia CEO Ben Buckley told me during a conversation we had last week.
Buckley is being diplomatic in the face of other sports trying to crowd him out but he's also right.
More importantly, he's also smart.
Asserting that no sport has a monopoly on the term football, even those sports that are more handball than football, should serve as a quiet ssshhh to the paranoid mobs, usually associated with Australian rules football, obsessed with ownership rights.
"The name 'football' certainly makes for good colourful debate," Buckley said. "A lot of codes call themselves football. American football, Gaelic football, rugby league gets called football. I don't think that anyone has a proprietary right to the name."
This remember from a guy who played Aussie rules professionally and was a senior executive at the Australian Football League before joining Football Federation Australia.
What sparked my question to Buckley was a bizarre exchange between a guy called Kevin Sheedy, famous in Victoria as an Aussie rules coach, and Andrew Demetriou, the CEO of the AFL, during an interview published in a Melbourne newspaper.
"Andrew," Sheedy asked. "How do we stop Frank Lowy and Ben Buckley from calling soccer 'football', yet they still manage to call the national team the Socceroos?"
Demetriou, if he was half as smart as Buckley, should have answered 'Who cares?'. Instead, the AFL boss couldn't help himself.
"There were 87,000 people at the MCG on Thursday and a few million watching on television who know what footy is," Demetriou replied, referring to the crowd at an AFL game in Melbourne.
Good luck to the AFL and good luck to Aussie rules.
"Clearly, football is the world game but in Australia everyone can coexist and cooperate," Buckley told me. "I think we all do get along. We all recognise it is a very competitive landscape but every one of the 'football' codes understands that we're all here to stay and can coexist. It is competitive but generally there is a spirit of cooperation when required."
As for the name 'Socceroos'? It, too, is here to stay.
"There is history in the name and it is a very recognisable and identifiable name," Buckley said. "The Socceroos name is a brand that is immediately understood by a lot of people in Australia.
"It is something that is debated from time to time," Buckley added. "Given that over the past few years we have made a very determined effort to have the game known as football, we have discussed whether the moniker should stay.
"But I think it is here for the foreseeable future. There is a lot of equity in the name but it is good to have that debate from time to time. I think we have bigger issues to deal with in football than this one."
That last line? That's the end of it.
COMMENTS
The way I see it. The game is called Football. The nickname of Football is Soccer (and hence people can call it soccer). The nickname of the Australian National Football Team is the Socceroos.
No contradictions, no problems.
- by dasilva on April 12, 2009 at 01:29 AM
Football is an international game and 87,000 at an AFL game in Melbourne is irrelevant in the context of the whole planet. Refusing to acknowledge the world game as football would be like Australia denying the word polio and calling it "wobbly legs". It just doesn't work.
- by Rudi Kolkman on April 12, 2009 at 08:34 AM
as long as you love your game and don't go out and rubbish someone else's, who cares what the game is called? For my mind, both rugby codes and AFL are about as close to 'football' as snooker but when my son picks up any kind of ball, we "are going out to kick the footy". Only those that are paranoid need worry about this non-issue
- by Mat on April 12, 2009 at 04:34 PM
typical melbourne, not thinking outside there own postcode...
But i have too thought about the name of the Socceroos, it does come from the old establishment of Soccer Australia but it's come to mean 'sort of' like what Azzuri means to the Italians or Oranje for the Dutch. It's apart of the national team and it recognizes the history that went before so-called 'new football' like the 98' team (didn't qualify but i still consider it one of the great teams we've produced) and the 74' WC team. That history of what went before should be held, and to brand it with a new identity would do a way with the old history, and the 'Footballroos' just dosen't work does it?
Although Buckley is right and that it's rather trivial really
- by thomas Kelly on April 12, 2009 at 06:47 PM
in the 2 countries that football is the least game played and watched, it is called soccer. but for the rest of the world it is known as football.
the idea that the other codes can even compare or even actually use their feet to play is beyond me. in order to play football you have to use your feet. in the other codes you barely even notice that!
then again now it just comes to marketing and the way the masses are swayed in these 2 nations. but if you talk to anyone outside these 2 countries and mention soccer, people go: "what? what is that? oh you mean football".
- by j on April 13, 2009 at 04:32 AM
Everyone in the world knows the game as football, and that's far more than 87k and a couple of million watching on tv. There are more watching every run of the mill league game in China every weekend, and that's just 1 country!
AFL has half a grab on the name the same as NFL. As for League and Union calling themselves footy, that is just comical.
At any rate, there are bigger issues for other codes to deal with, like the impending death of League and Union!
- by Steve Raynor on April 13, 2009 at 07:38 AM
there is only ONE TRUE FOOTBALL. fact
- by mk on April 13, 2009 at 08:33 AM
Football is the World Game. Kevin Sheedy and his 87,000 people at the MCG should try going to England where Old Trafford, Wembley, Anfield, Chelsea all sell out all seating 5 years ahead of their matches. I dream of seeing Man Utd playing anybody in the English Premier League. That is all it is though. A dream. This game is massive. Australian Football League is only Australian. They don't play a vast array of international teams. They play Ireland. Take your blinkers off bogan.
- by Josho on April 13, 2009 at 08:50 AM
But lets get real for a minute here. Australian Rules is the ORIGINAL code of FOOTBALL in Australia going back to the mid 1800's. All those foreign games were imported after that. The name is taken folks.
- by john waller on April 13, 2009 at 09:09 AM
That would be like not calling redhead people bluey anymore. Can not believe how much publicity somebody like sheedy gets, the bloke is a d%^l.
- by Mick on April 13, 2009 at 09:16 AM
From what I have observed, those involved in AFL tend to call their game footy rather than football. (I think this was also true of NRL 50 years ago but seems to be dropped).
The round ball game is ahead
-on participants
-on potential player income
-on world reach
-on national acceptance
It is clear that Victory's average home attendace of 25,000 is not equal to that of AFL clubs and lets give them that. Lets face it....they need the turnstyles so they can pump money into markets outside Melbourne and prevent their sport becoming an irrelevence to the rest of the country.
- by manners on April 13, 2009 at 09:28 AM
what moniker you bestow on the national team is a dilema that the AFL will never have to worry about.
- by JB on April 13, 2009 at 09:50 AM
Matthew Hall is so wrong. I follow both Aussie Rules and soccer and in my experience its some people who follow soccer who arrogantly refuse to use the term soccer and believe that it is the only code that can call itself football. I have been corrected a number of times for referring to the game as soccer. It's no wonder the code is struggling to gain more fans from other codes.
- by Paul on April 13, 2009 at 09:54 AM
As was mentioned in the main story why bother calling any game football when the art of actually kicking a ball is only a minor part of the game.Thugby should be called handball,after all all they do is throw the ball to someone who runs then throws it to someone else,then again,and again*BORING* it may be a tough game but most teams dont have one single brain between them.
The name soccer is NOT a nickname it comes from the games early days when it was called Association football which was then was shortened to Soccer.
- by hoova on April 13, 2009 at 10:05 AM
Ben Buckley, what can we do for The Age to start following other Fairfax newspapers and stop calling the game soccer and start calling it by it's proper name FOOTBALL?
- by Simon on April 13, 2009 at 12:16 PM
You're right in saying that no one sport owns the name "Football"...
In the light of the fact the name "soccer" is just a bastardisation of "Association Football" and "Socceroos" is just drawn from that it's clear to see the only way out of this is to rename the national men's football team the Ass-footeroos and be done with it :)
- by Anthony on April 13, 2009 at 12:21 PM
Classic thats all I can say.... AFL has a place in the landscape and good luck to them but it is a microcosm of the world and outside of VIC and WA no-one gives a toss about the sport it has no international relevance.
Just for the record AFL has the third yes third highest number of registered players in Australia at about 450,000.
Football/Soccer has around 240 million internationally.
- by steve on April 13, 2009 at 01:35 PM
Bollocks!
I am sick some groups in Australia embarrassing us by trying to demand that Football is anything other than Football. Th Americans can get away with it because we all know how arrogant they are and let's face it, they have considerable clout, but even the international community ignore their efforts to change the name of the game to Soccer.
Fact IOC recognizes "Football" as an Olympic event.
- by Jed Petersen on April 13, 2009 at 01:49 PM
I think John Waller needs to refer to the historical origins of the term 'football' if he wants us to get real. The term football was applied to the round-ball version in mid 19th C Victorian Britain. Why ? Because it describes the nature of the sport - kicking a ball with your FOOT. Yes Australian Football has been around since the 1850's but did not formally or informally use the term football until well after the round-ball version. Sheedy is ignoramus whilst Peter Fitsimmons (an intelligent and insightful journo) resents the socceroos have usurped his beloved Wallabies as Australia's national team. What does this tell us. Football is having an impact and isn't going away. Heaven forbid but even some league fans have started to sing terrace style at NRL games. A compliment if ever there was one.
- by Simon on April 13, 2009 at 02:37 PM
Can we please a have a football/soccer forum on SMH where we are not debating how AFL is superior to Soccer or Soccer is a world game and League is not?
When you start these types of useless forums it just shows your lack of interest or knowledge of Soccer.
Why not talk about the upcoming challenges for the Socceroos? Who are we likely to face in the WC2010 should we qualify? How far can we go this time?
Just sick of these dumb forums.
- by sfx on April 13, 2009 at 05:40 PM
Who cares. I love the finesse and skill of football but also the physical and mental toughness of AFL. They are both brilliant games to watch, they are both football to me.
As for Sheedy...well he's a true legend of Australian football
- by Belgian Bomber on April 13, 2009 at 06:25 PM
I remember a few years ago everyone was happy when it was called Soccer here in Australia. Then they invented the "A League" and insisted on being called Football. That divided the country (witness the media issues....Soccer/Football etc) and now we're still talking about this issue.
What was wrong with being called Soccer? That's the national team's name so what's the issue? If they had kept the name and left Australian Football alone they'd have a lot more support. This is Australia and we have Australian Football. All other codes are imports and they should be treated as second-tier sports - no matter what the rest of the world are doing.
- by TonyB on April 13, 2009 at 08:04 PM
Firstly, of all our "codes" played in Australia, only rugby and their fans, players and administrators do not get confused about their game's identity, hence it is rugby, full stop.
The other 'egg-ball' games are played mostly ball in hand and passing by hand, so hardly football or footy, although scoring by foot is the predominant method in AFL (except, hilariously, those some of those deliberate one point own behinds).
That leaves our football based upon the world game played in every nation of the planet, and including the biggest sporting event in the world.
Agree with Ben that the endearing term "Socceroos" and instantly recognisable badge and brand name needs to stay and can co-exist with being football - even the local Germans loved this name at the 2006 finals.
Will we ever get the Melbourne/Adelaide/Perth media to call our game football? It will need generational change to win that one, though hosting the World Cup and then winning it one day will be the best way to overcome the "boofheads"!
- by Pablo on April 16, 2009 at 03:16 PM
The fascinating question Tony is, who imported football to this land in the first place? By your own deffinition, does this mean that your sport is also part of the second tier?
- by SW on April 17, 2009 at 01:01 PM
Soccer is soccer its only called football in England everywhere else its soccer. AFL is older thansoccer. You can only score a goal in AFL with your feet not your head like soccer. Soccer is dead in Sydney crowds are smaller than they were 20 years ago and AFL is getting bigger. Socceroos games are crushingly boring. Most countries in Asia don�t care about soccer.
- by Dave on April 19, 2009 at 02:52 PM
Dave, get your head out of the sand mate! I am embarrassed for you.
- by Mark on April 26, 2009 at 12:20 AM
Dave, get your head out of the sand mate! I am embarrassed for you.
- by Mark on April 26, 2009 at 12:20 AM
Lets get the story straight.
Footballs history began in England and, with the general expansion of the British Empire in the 19th Century - the game spread throughout the world including believe it or not Australia. One of the distinctive features of the game is that you play the game with your foot. (Dave... you are a d___head..it is not called soccer everywhere but England and no... Australian Football it is not older than Football. You've just just been yellow carded from the debate mate and one more ridiculous comment will earn you another yellow and inturn an instant Red....don't make me do it..)
Rugby football, conceived in and around 1823 when the famed William Webb Ellis alledgedly picked up the ball and ran with it during a 'football' match, is a derivative of the original 'football'. The game was picked up by the upper classes of British society who, in England's highly stratified social makeup, saw football as a working class game which it originally was. Rugby Football was picked up in Australia by the mainly Protestant sector of the fledgling Australian society, mainly in NSW and Qld. The game splintered further along secterian lines when the Catholics broke away to form their own league in 1908 and pay their players. The Catholics made up the then working classes in Sydney.
Australian Rules football was conceived as a way of keeping Victorian cricketers fit in the winter time. One of its leading proponents in its early days, a gentleman by the name of Thomas Wills, whose statue adorns the MCG, also played in the very first cricket test match in 1877. Australian Rules football, because of its propensity to kick far more than either of the Rugby codes, is the only code that can rightfully challenge 'football' for any perceived 'ownership' of the name football. (Inspite of the comments by Xenophobic Tony B and John 'Wally' Waller)
Bottom Line....People like Demetriou and that rather articulate Rugby Boofhead Fitzsimons are scared and ignorant..scared of what their beloved codes may lose and ignorant of the possibility that all codes can survive and thrive in this dynamic football market. Footballs commitment to Summer, ensuring that some type of football is played all year round, simply confirms their realistic perspective of where they sit in this the early days of the A-League and their understanding that they must co-exist with the other codes. Cannibalism means only one survives. Who is willing to take that risk?
Finally.....if your not a football follower and interested in debating football the original game....what are you doing on this blog site?
- by Cav on April 26, 2009 at 10:08 PM
I wasn't going to comment but after reading dave's comment I couldn't help myself.
You're hilarious mate you remind me of the booners in my town that were convinced rugby league was Australia's national sport. The only countries in the world that it is called soccer is primarily the US, Canada, and Australia and New Zealand (where it can be interchangeable with wog ball) even non English speaking countries call it a variation of the English word e.g. in Turkish 'futbol'. Asian countries don't care about football? turn on your TV.
Generally for the blog, all these games are called football as they all evolved from a common game. 'soccer' has had a more direct descent but would still be unrecognisable to the middle ages game in volving whole villages, Rugby (thats rugby union, to the league fans who still call it Union) evolved when William Webb Ellis picked up the ball and ran with it in Rugby school in England. The Rugby League were a group of players that broke away (from what was afterwards called the Rugby Union to differenciate) because they wanted to be professional and have certain rule changes. American Football or Gridiron evolved along the same lines in the states with the forward pass being legalised after an appeal by Roosevelt after too many college students were getting hurt. They are other variations around the world e.g. gaelic and aussie rules. All these are called football by their adherents. All of them have the right. The problem is that many refuse to use their own specific classifications in inter-code dialogue. Aussie rules, Rugby, League, Soccer, Gridiron. Sure these may not be your first choice as football is but you have no right to deny the other codes their own hereditary rights.
- by Nathan on April 26, 2009 at 11:33 PM
I love lines like 'Everyone in the world knows the game as football'.
Rubbish!! Firstly, any quick sample of newspaper websites around the English speaking world shows Scotland, England and Sydney to be in the minority of referring to 'football' for 'Association Football (aka soccer)'.
So, let's be clear. Australia is RIGHT to align with the US, NZ, Canada etc in disambiguation of 'football'.
The reality is that most the world is 'football poor'. By that, they may know only one code, or one major code locally. That's hardly a premise for forcing people in much more highly competitive sports and football markets to adopt a usage based on these countries who are ignorant or under-serviced.
At any rate, FIFA is the International federation of Association Football (when correctly translated to English). The FIFA rules are simply the 'rules of the game', and EPL uses the 'rules of association football'. Heck, one of the most respected and long standing 'football' magazines is 'World Soccer'. Published still in England.
SO - - to all the soccer zealots trying to bully their way to a monopoly of the word 'football'. You don't have a leg to stand on........and especially when your game doesn't actually legislate FOR the foot. SImply, against the hand.
AFL for example legislates that a goal may ONLY be kicked. ANd a mark is a reward attainable only from a kick. That's a rule book positive enforcement of a kicking game. Soccer doesn't have that.
- by Michael C on April 30, 2009 at 12:59 PM
the so called afl is not afl,nor football,nor footy,nor aussi rule, it is simply irish hand stuff ,it is the same as rugby which is mainly done with hands therefore it can not be called by the above names.
galic people are the only onse who call football as soccer because they think that football is from england and due to the fact irish and welsh people do not like english people that is why they call it soccer.irish and welsh people must understand that football is not from england it is from the world.
you see only countries where irish people have seatlled they reffer to football as soccer ,such as australia and america and irland.
it is racial thing .have you ever asked yourselves why for instance japan,italy,ivory coast,...so on do not have hand stuff as the so called afland nfl?
well the answer because irish people do not live there.
in victoria the majority of people are irish that is why most of irish hand stuff clubs are here.
we must not let irish people to force their hand stuff on us,reject irish culture by reffering to the so called afl and nfl as irish hand stuff.
the ffa must change the name socceroos to australian football kangaroos or australian national football team.
the name soccer is hate name against football.people who hate football they call it soccer inn order to kill the game by strippingm it from it's name.
call ffa and urge them to change the name socceroos to football now not tomorrow.
we are not happy thatr be buckly is ffa chief because he does not come fro footballing background the ffa must appont football faithful to boss australian football.
the so called afl is not indiginous stuff at all as people of irish background try to potray in order to get the support of aboriginal and the rest of the population.
football has been a joke in australia in the past because it was called soccer not football.
we must not call the game by any other nam in australia apart from football or australian football and the A-LEAGUE as AFL .most people in the media they are of irish background therefore they keep call football as soccer.
- by megan on July 03, 2009 at 03:40 PM
1.4 Billion people (registered) play 'Football' on any given weekend around the world! get that lot into the MCG if you can Mr. Greek.
- by Philip Cox on October 02, 2009 at 07:54 PM
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......."I think we have bigger issues to deal with".......no kidding?
Who cares about this as long as you enjoy your code. I follow rugby chiefly, and couldn't care less if it is called football or not - I just enjoy the game.
I have no problem with Aussie Rules, but people like Kevin Sheedy think that you fall off the edge of the Earth when you leave the greater Melbourne city limits!